I'm writing this to keep track of my app, but mostly so that it's useful for some wayward wanderer. Have fun reading! Comment if you feel compelled to.
Asking for Advice: Use sdn - so useful (esp. the interview feedback) and addicting. Premed advisor if they seem reasonably sane. Don't ask other premeds, even if they're not in your year. They seem to harbor an intense dislike for anyone else entering the profession (that's why I'm an engineer).
LORs: Ask if profs can write you an EXCELLENT letter. If they hesitate, pick someone else. Mine: 1 research PI, two engineering profs and 1 humanities prof. I gave them all relevant info by first week of April. This includes resume, transcript (unofficial), tips, things to emphasize, envelope, waiver. I picked a few key ideas for each prof to focus on so that all aspects of my application and personality would be covered. It should complement PS but not overlap with it too heavily. All said they were excited to write them and will have them done by end of April!!! Give them an opportunity to back out of writing it - always important so the prof doesn't feel pressured to write a BS/general letter.
PICKING MED SCHOOLS:
Want about 35 schools total (good # for CA students). I had 4 categories: 'reach', 'high fit', 'fit', 'lower'. I eliminated schools that I will definitely not go to (temple and aecom because of location; schools that don't take a lot of OOS; TX schools because I don't want to do TMDAS on top of AMCAS). I found the LizzyM score of the remaining schools: (gpa*10)+ mcat - 1. Found the mean, stdev and fit the schools into groups. Then, I eliminated some because of curriculum (don't want all PBL, etc). Still trying to figure out my reaches - it's hard to pick which school I want to be rejected from most (I'm prayin' that's a joke everyone).
My method for picking my reaches:
-make a list of all possible reaches, pick a number from 1 to 10 (let's say 5). Count through the reaches until you get to the fifth school. Cross out that school. Repeat until you have the number of reaches you want. Look through what you crossed out. If you feel sad about leaving out any school - add it to the master list of schools to apply to. Repeat this until you have all the schools you need. It worked for me. Suprisingly, I'm very attached to UPitt. I don't know why.
PS: I've had the first paragraph and outline in my head for 6 months. Getting it on paper is hard - try free-styling it initially just to get ideas down. Then edit, edit, edit. I'll get mine edited by career center people, my PI, my english profs, any hobo in Berkeley since they mostly have advanced degrees. I'm an author so writing isn't too foreign for me, but writing about myself sucks. One more thing, read example PS's before writing your own - it helps to see how tightly structured they should be. But never read an example PS while writing your own - you might plagiarize unknowingly or lose your writing voice, part way through.
Update:
6/18/08 - Writing about myself sucks so bad! I haven't been able to work on it much because my summer research is taking up too much time. I feel guilty and am hoping for a flash of inspiration.
6/18/08 - Inspiration strikes! I think I found a unifying theme for my PS while riding the train.
6/19/08 - my transcripts have been verified; my list of schools is updated; my PS is about done. I'm super excited to get this show on the road! Good luck to my fellow 2013ers!
9/16/08:
Haven't updated for awhile. A lot has happened. I wrote tons of secondary essays. Spent all of the money from my summer internship on med school apps. I burnt out with all the writing (about late August). Am slowly recovering from that and finishing the remaining 6 secondaries (Duke is especially killin' me, just sitting there in aquamarine on my app spreadsheet - make one by the way to keep track of money, dates, turnover time, deadlines).
Got 4 interviews (SLU, UPitt, NYMC, Drexel) so far. After the first one, I don't think I really registered what it means. I feel so blessed now. So so so so glad that there was nothing horribly wrong with my primary essay. I was confident about it but it was about religion (central to my path to medicine; I tried really hard to avoid preachy-ness).
Bought two suits for the interviews - one charcoal grey pantsuit with light blue checks on it; the other wheat colored skirt suit. Bought a super awesome red bag to go with these. Need brown shoes for the wheat suit. When I say 'bought', I'm lucky enough that my parents able to afford and are willing to pay for this. I couldn't do this without them. They're med school experts now.
Been reading 'Understanding Health Policy' by Bodenheimer for general health care knowledge. Found on McGraw-Hill's Access Medicine through my UC Berkeley account.
9/22: Got the UCSF rejection via snail mail. Not too bummed about it. My dad was more frustrated than me; he even offered to beat someone up at UCSF. I told him it's not necessary. I just have to stop picking #1's. My #1 school was Mayo -> rejection. Then it was UCSF -> rejection. Right now, no #1, no top choice, nothing. I'm leaving it to God.
9/26: I'm in the midst of a dry spell in terms of interview invites. I check my email three times a day, just waiting for Inbox(1). When it actually appears, I get super excited until I see that it's just spam or worse, newsletters from short story contests that I wrote for a long time ago, who rejected me, who need to remind me that they picked someone more talented. Rejection doesn't bother me much anymore. Even waiting for med school responses is OK. Read Dale Carnegie's 'How to Stop Worrying and Start Living' - sounds lame but it's the one of the more important things I have read in my life.
How I prepared for interviews:
-made a list of likely questions for each school based on SDN's interview feedback
-did mock interviews (in front of mirror or taped or just alone)
-made a list of ~10 to 15 questions that I need to ask about each school
-read the school websites, fact books, guide books, etc
-reminded myself how freakin' awesome I am (kidding but confidence is key)
-had a REALLY, REALLY well-thought-out answer for why medicine and why a certain school
-trusted God to guide me to my future
Interview Reflections:
SLU:
Stayed at the Water Tower Inn, which is on the campus and has a direct shuttle to the med school front door. I recommend it highly. Only problem - there's no real places to eat in walking distance of school. I've been spoiled by Berkeley food. So, I got to the office of admissions early, chatted with other interviewees who were surprisingly awesome. Went to my interview, though I heard it might be intense from a fellow interviewee. But it was pretty chill. It felt like the interviewer was typing up a transcript of whatever I said. Lot of questions on my family, volunteering and random things off my AMCAS. Of course, the 'why medicine' and 'why SLU' came up. He was just trying to get a feel for who I am.
-The tour was awesome - the campus is really nice, tons of foucs on training great clinicians, not so much on research but they do infectious disease work. Their block curriculum is a blessing; maybe that's why they've had the country's top Step 1 scores for a few years running. We didn't get to see the simulation center, unfortunately. From what I saw, the 3rd and 4th yrs seem really happy. The 1st and 2nd, not so much. But everyone (receptionist to construction guy to med student to nurse to attending) are super super nice.
-St. Louis, the city, doesn't suck but it isn't that great. Lots of crime, area surrounding school is pretty shady, esp at night. Def. need a car to get around. They recommend living about 10-15 mins away.
-Catholic school, so has crosses, a chapel and Father Baker. Religion isn't pushed on anyone; Father Baker seems like a great resource/friend to talk to. My only reservation is about the crappiness of the city. As my tour guide put it, 'There are lots of people in St. Louis with nothing to do; that's the problem.'
UPitt:
Was super excited for this one. UPMC literally takes up the entire city of Pittsburgh, which is breathtaking in the fall (leaves changing color, slight fog like in Berkeley). Interview day is long (8am to about 3ish pm). Some of the other interviewees were awesome (an ex-Army guy, an actress, a single mom, etc). There was one that was a really, really abrasive guy (asking questions that are just to show off his knowledge, asking questions that start with 'I interviewed at UF a few days back...'). If anyone asked one question, he'd have to follow that with two of his own. He might be a genius but come on.
-ignoring him and his questions, the school is awesome. The tour was a tour of the hospitals (they're connected by walking bridges) and of the city. It's really a college town since so many undergrad schools are there too. The WISER simulation center is SO SO SO SO AWESOME and right up my alley, as an engineer. An anesthesiology attending who was awesome (because of the Star Trek references) talked to us as little about the dummies. We went into the anatomy lab - didn't smell so bad, clean. There was a leg just sitting on a table (not a dissecting table, a studying table). Kind of disorienting. Flat screen tvs at each station. Great teaching atmosphere. Students are really enthusiastic about Pitt. Our guide said PBL's not too useful for 1st yr but great for 2nd yr. Balance is encouraged (bet academics and extracurric, fun and work, research and clinical skills, etc).
-had lunch with one MS3 and an admin person; no other med students showed up unfortunately. But this one MS3 is the reason I got so so excited about Pitt. Talked about how they lack gunners except this one gunner who tutors other med students. Talked about how awesome his class mates were, how carefully they are chosen and how the classes are so close-knit.
-had a student interview then a faculty interview. Student and I had lot in common; went well; really casual, conversational. Just don't say anything stupid because it seems so casual (my interviewer told me some horror stories). It's weighed the same as the faculty interview. Student was super nice, gave me his email address and walked me to my next interview.
-faculty interview: they try to match you with an interviewer in your field of interest. So, talk about your interest in that field (I stupidly forgot to). Faculty read my AMCAS carefully. Lots of good questions. Routine questions, except the 'What plans do you have for a family?' question, but that was casual too. They know what kind of person fits at Pitt (it's really obvious when you talk to the current students). They're trying to see if you are that kind of person; you can't fake this btw. Just relax.
-lots of mentoring in this place. Can't fall through the cracks. I asked lots of questions about this (mentoring bet MS2 and MS1, MS3 and MS2, bet faculty and students, etc). Really important to me, if I'm moving so far away from home. I need that safety net.
-city is so awesome, good mix of big city with small town feel, very little crime, so safe, apartments opposite to med school, but 200 days of rain a yr and pretty gray skies year round. There's a reason Pitt is so well respected. No lack of resources, no lack of money, no lack of enthusiasm. I LOVE PITT so much that I'm having dreams about the auditorium where they hold the white coat ceremony.
Drexel:
Day started at 9am with orientation. The other students were eerily quiet. Basically has two curriculum paths: IFM (more traditional, lecture based) and PIL (is PBL). I was leaning towards IFM but we went and saw a PIL small group in action - seemed really cool, especially after talking to the professor who is head of PIL. Man, he was so awesome and encouraging. He told our interviewing group that there's no doubt we'll be becoming doctors - kind of heavy praise but I'll take whatever I can get. Then, the same admin lady gave us a tour of the Queen lane campus of the school. I wish we had a student-led tour because it would be much less formal and more inviting. Anyway, the school's in a safe, small, residential area. Pretty too. Has about 200 students in every class (M1, M2, etc), which is a bit high but nothing I'm not used to at Cal. Facilities look nice except the anatomy lab which is in a basement and kind of dark and scary looking. Then, had my faculty interview at Hahnemann campus (take a 20 min shuttle ride from Queen lane campus). My interviewer is this world-famous oral surgeon with a bagillion degrees. I had no idea because they give you your interviewer's name the day of the interview. Anyway, I asked him why he's stayed at Drexel for over 30 yrs - yeah, I know, the question sounds kind of snarky, but I was curious. Led to an interesting discussion about the faith he had in Drexel's ability to train great physicians. He studied all over the world, in awesome med schools and he stuck around at Drexel. So, that in itself was impressive. He was super thorough and went through my AMCAS line by line almost. But that's actually good in my situation. After that, took the shuttle back to Queen lane campus. TAKE A JACKET!! Man, it was cold. My indian bones be shiverin'. Had a student interview over lunch. Cafeteria wasn't bad. Student interviewer was super cool, wanted to know a lot about my involvement in clubs. Said the 200 class size was actually a good thing - can have good friends but not too small to be cliquish. They're big on mentoring at this school, which I loved. All in all, I'm pretty impressed with Drexel.
NYMC:
Started at 8am; they provided breakfast but interviewees were super hungry, so I don't think it was enough for everyone. But I ate ahead. Other interviewees ranged from super cool, to neurotic to awkward to wanna-know-how-many-other-interviews-I-have. Had orientation then a M4 talked to us about the school, clerkships, how well they are prepared for wards, etc. She was kinda insane but in a great way. Key point here: the whole school is like a big family. This is very important for me and was reiterated by many sources. Another cool point: they have mini-board exams at the end of each class, even in M1. Being well-prepared is always awesome. Curriculum is subject-based, not organ, etc. M1 is mostly lecture. M2 is alot of self-study, some small groups, labs, etc. Had a financial aid talk which was important. Having a credit score above 700 (credit card on your name, less debt, pay monthly charges on time, etc) is key to get scholarships and NYMC loans. TAKE A JACKET! It was super cold and we had a good hour or so in which they told us to wander around. Westchester med is a level I trauma center, btw. Then, two M2s took us on a tour of lecture halls, small group areas, hospital, etc. We went into the tour guide's apartment - kinda small, dorm-like, had two single bedrooms, kitchen, living space, 1 bathroom, etc. Kinda like dorms but with own bedrooms. We didn't see anatomy lab because the M1 exam was going on but it's super well lit, has a skylight, clean, great facilites. Surrounding area is super, super rural but beautiful. Students get free parking. Have a scribe system for $200 to get word-by-word of what professor says in class (no webcast though). Then, had my faculty interview with a super-cool professor. They tell us to take two copies of our personal statement, but my interviewer already had mine printed out and marked up. Suffice it to say, we really clicked - my emphasis on religion and its place in my life, my writing, favorite authors, music - he loved all of it. He really understood me, like very few people have in my life. Super surprising. He told me how well NYMC trains students in M3 and M4, how well they match (great match lists), how great professors are, how close-knit the class of 190 or so is, etc. There is very little that I didn't like about NYMC. The rural location is kinda a turnoff. But everything else is so awesome.
UCSD:
The weather there is gorgeous and supposedly the day I was there was 'chilly' as described by the native SD'ers. If chilly means above 70 degrees and a light breeze, then chilly is freakin' awesome. I never liked hot weather but it wasn't really hot in SD, more like a sunny mild. Day started at 7:55am with an orientation talk. Told us that they will try to squeeze us in for next Monday's adcom meeting (12/15). So, they might have a decision for us by Tuesday (12/16). If we get a call during the day, that means acceptance. If its an email, that means waitlisted. Then we had two interviews; both of mine were with MDs. They went really well, I think. Both interviewers knew my file cold - primary, grades, secondary essay, everything. My first interviewer and I talked about religion and spirituality the entire time. Well, it's a big part of my journey and my essays, so I was essentially asking for those questions by writing about religion. A bit taboo. But break the rules if you can handle it. My second interviewer and I talked about movies, my upbringing, my school and some about raising a family in med school or residency. She reassured me that it's worth it to have kids. After the interviews, we had lunch with two M1s and two M2s. The current students are usually representative of most students at that school. So, I always use them to see if I would fit in at that school. Strangely, I felt like I had more in common with the male med students than the female ones. I guess 4 years in engineering will do that to a person. Undoubtedly, they were all happy there. They also reassured us that UCSD wasn't competitive and I believe them. After lunch, we had a tour, but it wasn't extensive. Just the lecture hall, library, some research buildings. A new teaching-only building will be built by 2010, which is super cool-looking. A few of the hospitals are close to the campus, but we didn't see them, unfortunately. Then we had some admin officials talk to us. Man, they were awesome. The director of admissions is hilarious. The office of student affairs head is a surfer and talked about how they try to promote student life, health, and general sanity. He also has a key to Black's beach. Supposedly, that's like having a key to the Holy Grail or something. I'm not a surfer but the beach is literally 10 minutes away. That is amazing. At the end of the day, we watched a nice video on the Student run-free clinic - the best part of UCSD, in my opinion. I unfortunately couldn't go on the tour of the free clinic. But if you have the chance, GO! The whole day was really enjoyable. Small complaint: they should give us water at the start of the day. Or orange juice or coffee. If my interviewer didn't offer me a water bottle, I would've died of thirst. The rest of day I spent sightseeing, going to beaches, going up to Mt. Soledad for the views, going to downtown, seeing the Gaslamp district, roaming around with the people I stayed with. I don't know if La Jolla is for me, but there's no question that UCSD is beautiful, relaxing and a great environment to learn, to serve and to live. I'm soooo excited to see if they liked me as much as I liked them.
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11/3: After a long day of working on final projects, which are moving along at a snail's pace with no end in sight, I called my mother as I was coming home. She was opening the day's post and read my entire Drexel acceptance letter to me on the phone!!!! I couldn't stop smiling the whole way home. Then, I got right back into work mode. Now, I'm just sitting here, letting it sink in. If my grandfather were alive, he would be so happy. He was always my main support - in academics, in writing, in life. Today's a little bittersweet. But my dream has come true - I will be a doctor, for sure!! It's been hard waiting for secondaries, waiting for interviews, waiting for post-interview responses. And the first response was a waitlist from SLU. But I know why that happened. When asked why SLU, I didn't have an answer unique to SLU. It could've applied to any med school. The Drexel interview went well. My interviewer said that my reasoning in choosing medicine was exceptional. I know, it's kinda crazy, but feels good to hear it from someone who isn't me. My acceptance letter was dated 11/24 and I interviewed on 11/10 - that's a 14-day turnaround. WOW!
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12/17: Just got two new interview invites today - Keck and U of Vermont. I really can't believe it. I thought for sure I was done at this point. People get interviewed in Jan, Feb, March and even April and get into schools. But I felt like I was done. Or maybe I wanted to be done with the waiting and the wishing and the hoping. All good, though. I know people would kill for interviews at these schools. I'm really excited at the idea of traveling again, especially to Vermont and LA. I just don't know if my wallet is all that thrilled. It'll get over it. I've been extremely lucky in applying for med school. Just want to use this opportunity to thank my family. They're now experts in this process. They've been with me as I drudged through secondaries, as I burned out with writing, when I got each interview, sometimes came with me to the interview towns, and when I got accepted. Constant, unconditional support. I'm so freakin' lucky, I don't know what to do with myself.
1/4/2009: Happy New Year everyone! I have a feeling that 2009 is gonna be a marvelous year. It'll be difficult for sure, starting and adjusting to med school and all. As always, I'm excited for what's to come. I just hope that with all these changes, I won't lose my sense of self.
On a med school related note, I should hear back from UCSD on January 13th (the adcom meets on Jan 12th). I'm hoping it's a call not an email (acceptances announced by phone). In the meanwhile, I'm writing thank you notes to my UCSD interviewers, since I didn't write them immediately. There is no definitive evidence that thank-you notes help an applicant. But I figure it's basic courtesy. So, I don't really care if it helps or not. It can be by email (if you have it) or by post (if you don't). I basically mention the date I interviewed on and a few things we talked about. I thank them for reading my app so closely and for interviewing me. That's really about it. It takes me a while to write but it should be pretty simple, in theory. I also have to write an update letter (email actually) to Pitt. When I start on that letter, I'll write about what I'm including in it.
Oh, and God bless the semester system! I don't start school until Jan 20th. I've got 16 more glorious days of watching TV and movies, reading awesome books (finished Atonement, Kite Runner, Love and Longing in Bombay), cooking and sleeping. Peace out!
1/7/09: I update this thing too often. It looks like I don't have a life. But good news this time: I got into NYMC!! Now, I have a choice. Let's just take a moment to realize how momentous that sentence is. About 50% of the people who apply to med school don't get in. Anywhere. And I get to frickin' chose between two schools. So far, that is. Damn, it feels good to be validated. Feels like the first time someone tells you that you're pretty. Second time feels just as good. Not that I need someone to tell me this, but it's nice anyway. And now the next step is FAFSA, where I'll enter in a bunch of 0's for my section and still get no money from schools who assume my parents will pay for my education. But worrying about financial aid and FAFSA is a good thing - 'cause it means you got into med school.
1/17/09: Nooooooooooo! I was put into the 'Acceptable Pool' for UCSD. It's the same thing as a waitlist. Obviously, I'm not acceptable enough for an acceptance. This is sad; first Pitt then UCSD. But, I guess it's understandable. Pitt interviews lots of people and accepts few (about 35% or something). UCSD has a high avg mcat and gpa for accepted people, higher than mine. From sdn archives, I gather that the acceptable pool moves well enough (~80 out of 134 enrolled students came from acceptable pool). They use some 'magic number' which is your gpa, mcat and a score for how well your interviews went to determine who to take out of the pool. My scores are average, but my interviews went really well. Or maybe I'm delusional. I should hear back by end of April at the earliest. On May 15th, supposedly, they place people in a real waitlist, which it is really hard to get off of. So I read; things might have changed. Oh, and schools starts soon. Good luck next semester or quarter or trimester to all!
LAST POST EVER:
Hi to whoever is reading this! So, this entire process has dragged on for over a year. I applied in June 2008 and ended in July 2009. So, a summary is in order:
Applied: 35 schools
Got interviews: 9 great schools (SLU, Pitt, NYMC, Drexel, UCSD, MCW, USC, Vermont, EVMS)
Actually interviwed: 6 schools
Acceptances: 2 (NYMC, Drexel)
Waitlists: 4 schools (SLU, Pitt, UCSD, USC)
Withdrew from waitlists: 3 schools (SLU, Pitt, UCSD)
Accepted from waitlists: 1 school (USC!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!)
Yep, I got the call from Dr. Quinn on July 2nd, right before she was leaving on vacation. After May 15th, I didn't see any waitlist movement, so I threw myself into preparing to go to NYMC. I researched places to eat, applied for loans and housing and all that jazz.
But one day in June, my mother told me to send a email of interest to Dr. Quinn. Now, my mom has been involved in this application process; she usually just listens and asks some questions. But this time, she was so adamant that I send that email. So I did. I got a response from Dr. Quinn in less than a day, explaining that she was just looking at my file and wondering whether I was still interested. She said I was at the top of the waitlist. Now, this was great news. I had a shot at USC. So, listen to your mothers, folks!
I woke up one day in the first week of July and felt very strongly that I should send another email to Dr. Quinn. So, I did. I told her that I would go to USC if they accept me soon. I got the acceptance call just 2 or 3 days after this email.
By focusing on these feelings, I'm not trying to suggest that there's something supernatural going on or that aliens got me into medical school (oh but that would be cool!). I'm simply suggesting that I trusted my intuition (or whatever you call it) and it helped. These are all the documents I sent to USC prior to my acceptance:
-thank you letter to faculty interviewer
-update letter in April (so that it's before the May 15th review)
-short letter of interest after May 15th
-email of interest in June (two lines)
-email of interest/intent on July 1st (one line)
Moral of the story: Persistence (within limits) pays off. I'm so thankful for how this part of my life turned out. No regrets, seriously. And that's always hard for me to say.
Great things about USC:
-pass/fail for first 2 years
-great clinical training at LA county hospital
-students are treated like family
-admin really tries to make the med school process easier
-we get our own desk on campus
-they print out our notes for the week and give them to us
-most lectures recorded
-breakfast before exams
-big sibling program
-lots of help in every transition (bet years, to clinical training, etc)
The school is super expensive (and I didn't get any aid but didn't expect any either). But I feel like we do get more benefits for paying that much. And the admin seems more responsive to students' needs. For these reasons, I withdrew from all other schools/waitlists and accepted my USC acceptance! Only time will tell whether my decision was correct, but I strongly believe that wherever life takes me, it will only help me become a better person. So with that, I bid you adieu. Hope I helped in some way. And good luck with your application!
We help students become doctors. TM
